Episode #363 – Compete in a League of Your Own with Erin Hatzikostas

Compete in the league of your own with Erin Hatzikostas. You know, every now and then you meet someone who is just an absolute fireball, and Erin is one of those people you wanna siphon off like just a tiny smidge of her energy and kind of stuff it in your pocket. I love how Erin is unapologetically herself and how she has turned that into a point of difference, both for her personal brand and for her message. And Erin shares a really compelling framework in this episode, and also reveals a bit of her path to really learning how to compete in a league of her own. And I think you’re gonna love it. I wanna give you a little bit of Erin’s formal bio, just because I think I owe it to the women who and men who come onto this show to really share the credentials that they may not share with you directly.

So Erin calls herself a former corporate CEO Turned professional pot stir. I love that. And she is the bestselling author of a book called You Do You ish. She’s a TEDx and a keynote speaker, and she refers to herself as a coach consultant, and the co-host of an offbeat career and leadership podcast with Erin and Nicole. So Erin also has a new book out, and that is a lot of what we talked about during this episode. It’s called The 50% Rule. And I have to tell you, I’m in love with this idea and I don’t wanna, I don’t wanna spoil the surprise, like the way that she reveals what is the 50% rule I want you to get from the actual interview. But I gotta tell you, ever since completing this interview, that’s just, it’s one of those phrases that’s been running through my mind, like, how do you 50% that and her definition of it may surprise you.

So definitely worth the listen here. Erin is very well published. She has been featured on A, B, CCBS, the Business Insider Fast Company, and well and good. And she really has such a clear message, but she’s so fun to listen to that I can see why she spent the first half of her career working at a Fortune 50 company, and at the age of 42, she became the CEO of a subsidiary of that company. And then in three years she really turned that company around. Like she tripled earnings, her e employee engagement scores went through the roof. And her whole secret to doing it was radical authenticity. So you’re going to hear her talk about that as a core principle. Erin has a degree in statistics, which when you meet her you’ll be like, what? But it really backs up the quantitative nature of her work.

Like this stuff checks out, right? She’ll, she’ll tell you about a research study that she fielded to really go get the proof that the ideas that she was feeling instinctively really did check out. And she is married, so she’s married, has two teenage children similar to me. And she says that in her free time you can find her coaching basketball, running, skiing, drinking wine in her fat pants, which cracks me up. Or dancing wherever you’re not supposed to dance. So with that as an introduction and without any further delay, please meet Erin Hatzikostas. 

 

Cherylanne Skolnicki:
All right. Well Erin, welcome to the Brilliant Balance Show. I’m so happy to have you here because you are such a spitfire. This is gonna be a fun day.

Erin Hatzikostas:
same ditto .

CS:
So I’d love to start with something that just helps people get grounded in who you are and what your life is like. So what have you been up to today? What’s been on your schedule?

EH:
What a great question. So today was eclectic. I worked out, I always work out in the morning. I went for a walk. I had a coaching client of mine this morning. I took, I took a photo with, lemme just do this. My, um, I have a new book coming out, and Yukon, which is a local university, well not a local university, it’s, you’ve probably heard of it. UConn is hosting the event and they ordered 176 books. So I thought, okay, before I sign all these and put ’em in a box, I need to just up. So I did that and then I presented it to a client. I have a corporate client of mine where I’m doing some differentiation work. And so I presented the results of that. Yeah, I love it. I’m doing a little bit of this, a little bit of that

CS:
Being authentically you.

EH:
Yep

CS:
You Got it. as one does. So you obviously talk a lot about the idea of authenticity, radical authenticity, all the different ways of describing authenticity. And I want you to tell us a little bit about what are the common misconceptions that people have about what authenticity really is?

EH:
Yeah. Um, most people think it’s simply being yourself or sort of synonymous with transparency. And, um, so what happens when you think about it in terms of the workplace, which is where really, where I’m trying to, to push it, people are like, that sounds amazing. I’m gonna go to work and bring my whole self, be myself. And then they’re like, wait, oh crap. Does that mean like everybody else is gonna come do the same thing? Like, that’s not gonna work out well. And so I call that being authentic . That’s how we’re talking about authenticity. The Greek word, the Greek root is actually authentico and it means to be genuine. Mm-Hmm. . But it also means to be original and authoritative.

CS:
Oh, I like that.

EH:
And what I like to say is authenticity is exposing who you are when people least expect it in the service of others. And I think that’s the biggest thing I try to drill into people. Authenticity is actually not about you,

CS:
Huh?

EH:
You really wanna use authenticity both to make your life better and your career better, but also to make the workplace better. You have to think about it in terms of when you are more authentic, when you expose something, when you do a humility moment, when you tell a story, instead of giving bullets. When you do some of the things that I sort of tangibly prescribed to start training to be more authentic, what you’re trying to do is actually create connection. Yes. Trust, right? And actually build a little bit of intrigue. Like, you want people’s attention, you want them leaning in and being like, I’m not sure what she’s gonna say. Right? Like, and if you go to just give the example in the c like i I, if you go to a meeting and somebody’s got the ta the talking points, and you know, they sound perfect, but they have the talking points, you aren’t gonna pay attention. ’cause you’re like, there’s gonna be no mistakes, there’s gonna be nothing interesting. But if somebody goes and is authentic and tells a story and maybe is a little messy and a little imperfect, you’re, you’re not gonna, you’re not gonna look away because you’re gonna wanna know what’s going next. Yes. So that’s the biggest thing. It really isn’t about you, it’s actually about the other person. And then of course those benefits come back to you.

CS:
Yes. And as a vehicle for connection is what I’m hearing you say. So you have to kind of unfold it in real time. If you can’t prescribe or practice authenticity, it’s the genuineness of the moment unfolding in a way that wasn’t necessarily planned.

EH:
Um, I actually, no, I would say you can, you actually have to plan. So if you think about common in business, right? The easy path, the river is flowing, the current is mostly glowing towards the inauthentic. Simple, simple example. I had a guy write to me last week, uh, two weeks ago, we were supposed to meet, I was interviewing for this, this corporate project that I’m working on, never met him before. I was a broker in their space. And he sent me sort of a, you know, a typical email we were supposed to meet on a Friday. He said, Ugh, my Thursday lunch guy got it wrong. He thought we were meeting on Friday. Is it okay if we move our meeting back, you know, later in the day so I can take this lunch meeting right now, what’s easy, what’s normal? Oh, no worries, here are some options. Right? Super lazy, super. But I always pause and go, is there a way to create a connection point by using authenticity? So instead of doing the easy, and this is just a tiny bit of planning, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. A little bit of pause. I said to him, oh, I’m so glad I’m not the only one that does that. Right? Because your audience knows better than anybody. We are constantly a, you know, a poop show trying to figure out our schedules and

CS:
Right, right.

EH:
And all that. Like, I am for sure. Yes. Right. Showing up at my daughter’s, like doctor’s appointment on the wrong week and all those fun things that we do. So its authenticity actually has to be a little planned. It’s easier, you know, it’s easier to go to a meeting and a presentation. You know, let’s say you’re reporting out on the status of a project, just like a, just a normal meeting, it’s really easy to take the standard template to be like, here’s the agenda, here’s what we’re gonna do. You know, it’s a lot harder. It takes time to think about, well, you know, everybody’s feeling really burnt out. We’ve been working, we’re over, you know, over budget over time. We’ve been working on this project for a year and a half. They’re probably so sick of these. What if I told a story at the beginning that sort of motivated them and excited, maybe it’s metaphorical or something that gives them a little excitement at this point, right? That takes, that takes work. It does take planning. And so a lot of times authenticity, whether it’s because normal is easier or giving somebody something of more substance does take a little, it does take a little work. It

CS:
Takes a little bit of a plan. Okay. Alright. Corrected. I stand corrected and I, I guess I’m gonna have to grapple today with the difference between maybe the more broadly accepted definition of authentic and your spin on it. And I, this is relatable to me because it’s like my spin on the word balance. So when I put the word balance in the title of my company, I spend half my life trying to explain what I mean by balance, because everyone insists that it doesn’t exist. And so I think that’s, it’s relatable that you’ve twisted this term to mean exactly what you need it to mean. And I think that’s, there’s an education process we’re all gonna have to go on with you in today’s episode. So I’m here for it for sure. You mentioned, and I mentioned this in your bio, that, you know, you led a big company that your corporate background informs your work. And so when you were in the CEO seat of what I think is a $2 billion company, if my background is 2 billion.

EH:
Yeah. We had 2 billion assets under management. Okay. We were about a nine figure top, um, revenue company. Yep. Okay.

CS:
When you think about implementing this idea in that organization, beginning with yourself and then taking it through the leadership team and the other people there, like, what do you think makes it more challenging for leaders to adopt what you’re teaching or like yourself as a leader than it does for anyone else? Is there anything different?

EH:
Well, you know, everybody’s got their own challenges. Leaders these days are not just leading. I mean, that’s just Right, right. They’re, they’re doing and they’re leading. So, and I’m not saying that they’re more overworked than the average employee, but the reality is there’s a lot of code switching between, oh, I have to be inspirational, share, you know, Erin and, and I have to be, you know, actually have to do some of the work and get crap done for my boss. So I think in that sense it is, I think most employees will say, oh, it’s so much easier though because you have influence. Mm-Hmm. , and you’re not sort of encumbered, which I would also poo PI always say inspiration is a circular reference. It does not go from the top down. Sure. Um, I was way more inspired by the people, you know, the thousand people working, working for me than, you know, my SVP that I reported to and saw every couple weeks.

EH:
But I think the biggest challenge for most people, and that’s why it’s worth it to sort of twist your brain a little bit and think about the way I define it, and I’ve seen so many people love this, is that so many people want authenticity, but they don’t have it. And they’re like, well, that’s frustrating, but when you can say no, it’s actually tangible. There are things you can do, there are experiments you can take. That’s what I always tell people, right? Like, don’t change overnight, just start experimenting and Yes. Watching and collecting data, right. Like, so that example of the email I sent to the guy, just experiment. Like, that’s pretty low risk. And if you’re like, this guy is normally a stuffy stuff. And then he came onto the call and, you know, seemed to be totally warm to me because I gave ’em a line that was, you know, a little more

CS:
Unexpected.

EH:
Yeah. Unexpected, unexpected. So yeah, I think for most people, you know, I don’t just leave them at, that’s why I don’t leave them at the definition. I, um, I have a framework like all good thought leaders,

CS:
Like Yes, exactly.

EH:
I am all humans. And, and what I always say is like, these are training wheels or, or life jackets to keep with the metaphor of like swimming. Like I’m just trying to help you not be pulled down by that current that’s going so fast in the other direction and help you start swimming upstream. And so that’s, you know, the framework gives you not just not freaking adjectives and crap that you’d read about in a Forbes, Forbes article. It gives you tangible things that you can do and experiment with. And then I always say like, you should forget about humans, hopefully within three months, six months, 12 months, it’s just the training wheels. And then you’re gonna be so addicted. Like, I realized I had, you know, sort of this a addiction, like where a healthy addiction, when we collect data, if you will, that oh, people smokes, people, you know, executives, trust me, my negotiation goes better. You’re just gonna, then you’re just gonna keep doing it. Keep doing it because you like to do the things at work.

CS:
A hundred percent I need to do like 30 years ago when I was starting my career and didn’t know any of this. So humans is your acronym for your six principles of strategic authenticity. You wanna unpack that at whatever level you are comfortable doing in this format.

EH:
Yeah. So, you know, I spent a lot of time sort of reflecting what, what really makes people go without worrying about the definition, right? Mm-Hmm. just go, they’re so authentic. Right? And I found that there were really six principles that I, you know, coerced a little bit into, you know, the word humility,

CS:
An acronym, right? Right. Right. An acronym as one does,

EH:
As one does. Um, so the H stands for humility. And humility is a speed pass to connection and trust. And you know, that is what I teach, and that is how do you use humility in your introductions in a business meeting on your website. Like, I rarely go anywhere without starting with a humility moment. And then, and then I put the sort of big brag onto it. So it’s not just like, oh, I’m, I’m a total idiot, I’m snuff. But just to give you an example, I was with, uh, Yale University on Monday, right? And super intimidating. I’m not an Ivy League grad. And so I, the last thing I wanna do is come in there and be like, oh, we’re doing this fireside chat. I know it all. Like, like I wouldn’t listen to me. So I’m always putting in my pocket, like, what could I use for a humility moment?

Well, I was signing their book plates ’cause they bought my first book and like the first 10 of them I signed with the wrong book like an idiot. And luckily had to then take my daughter to work. And I was driving and I was like, you idiot, you have to go redo those. But I was like, oh, what a great moment to, you know, so I put a spin on it, like, you know, what you guys don’t know is they actually test you when, when you have to come in here. And I failed the test of the Ivy league school, right? So use humility as a speed pass to connection. U is for unexpected. You said it, people get so frustrated that people don’t pay attention to their emails, to them in the meetings. And I always just tell ’em, sorry, it’s your fault.

It’s your fault. You’re too, you’re too, you’re too expected. And, and it really gets to that original definition. People, you know, and you don’t have to be original or unexpected just to be like, Ooh, look at me. You know? What I like to say is, you know, authentic people focus more on what’s needed, not on what’s like you do with this podcast. Sure. Like, you know what’s needed. We need a little bit of audience, we get it, we get something from it. They get something from it. It’s not normal. I’m not just gonna go through the motions. So that unexpectedness, I’m sure has been such a, you know, a differentiator for you where people are like, Hmm, I wanna pay attention. So that’s the U. M is for model. And that essentially means shut up and show up that authentic people don’t, you know, freaking go, oh, we’re gonna change our culture here and here is the work.

Like, no, they demonstrate it. Right? They don’t say, oh, I really want us to be much more rigorous with our project plans. No. Come in and say like, here’s what I would do for a project plan. How do you, you know, show people what you want in 3D? How do you become the 3D model? You know, people always say, I’m a visual learner, right? You hear that all the time. Yes. I am usually like, oh, I need a PowerPoint or somebody to draw it. But think about it, what’s the best visual way to learn is to emulate somebody, right? Yeah. The A is for adapt. And that means to both plug into other people. And I always say that with a little bit of trepidation. That doesn’t mean assume that they don’t want authenticity because they look like a stuffy stuff. Mm-Hmm. But the way I show up here is different from the way I show up at keynotes.

You reflect, it’s a little bit of mirroring of like, what is their vibe mirror. Yeah. And you, you want to use that authenticity in a way that slowly sort of brings ’em out of their shell and doesn’t scare them away and make them feel, but adapt also means you, like I always say, if you had 10 hours to spend on why, you know who I am versus who I want to be, I would say I’d put about nine of those hours towards the latter. Like you, you can adapt. That’s called growth, right. And who you are. The N is narrate in our storytelling. But I needed the n the most underutilized superpower. And we see it more in the entrepreneurial

CS:
World. Yes, for sure. Um,

EH:
But in business in general, and whether you’re running your own business or you’re in a big corporation, you know, stories, I remember 22 times more than facts and figures. But it takes work like we talked about before, to collect those stories, to get used to using a story at the beginning of a talk versus, you know, the talking points. But that’s where people just sit back and go, oh, they’re so authentic. Because in that,

CS:
And it’s so memorable. It’s so memorable. Yeah.

EH:
Mm-Hmm, . Yeah. And they can connect, right? It all goes back to that connection and trust. And then the last is spark. Uh, s is for spark. And that really means like, it’s so powerful when you can go, wait, authenticity isn’t about me, it’s about the other person. But then when you zoom out and you start to use authenticity and realize that the way we get there, which people always like, well, my company sucks. Or like, our culture, like how do we get there? The way we get there is through this macro inspiration, sparking other people, creating sort of an inspiration platform. So when you are authentic, everybody else is, you know the story I like to tell, to stick with, you know,

CS:
To use your model. Mm-Hmm.

EH:
to use my model. You know, you know the birthday parties, I know you know this probably all of your listeners do too. When the kids were younger, they would go to some bouncy house or something. Yeah. And then the last half an hour, they put ’em in a room and they’d bring out the pizza. Mm-Hmm. . And then they would bring out the cake, right? And each of the kids, of course, oh, can I have a bigger piece? Can I have more ice cream? They all took their cake. And then the parents would sort of awkwardly stand around the outside, right? Mm-Hmm. And then when they got done with serving the kids, they’d always have some leftovers, right? And they would come over to you and they’d be like, Cherylanne, would you like a piece of cake? And what would most people say?

CS:
Every mom would say, oh, no, no, no, I’m fine. Don’t want a cake.

EH:
What are all those moms thinking?

CS:
I really want that cake.

EH:
That’s authenticity in the workplace.

CS:
Yes. Exactly.

EH:
Now, once you start eating the cake, guess what happens when you say, yeah, I’ll have a, I’ll have a piece like other people

CS:
Eat

EH:
The cake, I’ll have a piece that’s, and that’s what, you know, the spark really.

CS:
I love that. Like the matching, just telling the truth could be another way to get at this is like, what is your truth in that moment? Like your real actual truth for, and trusting that, trusting that you will build rapport and relationship with someone by sharing that versus doing what I think I should do or what’s expected of me in this moment. In other words, even if that’s, I’ll have talking points when I stand up to give a talk instead of storytelling. Breaking the mold a little bit is what Yep. I’m really hearing it come through.

EH:
Yeah. And ultimately doing what you would want. If you Right, it’s as simple as that. We all want the,

CS:
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EH:
You do you ish. Yeah.

CS:
Ish. So is the title of the book, and I wanna talk about both of them, but if, if people are trying to really get a sense of your work, is there a sequence? Would you, you wanna talk about you, do you ish and then the 50% rule? Or how would you sort these?

EH:
Yeah. So kind of tie them together. So yeah, I mean the story sort of goes, you do, you Ish is really talking about this epiphany that I had as a corporate leader and that authenticity was actually my strategy. It is a tangible thing you can do, right? And the human framework and all of that. While I was doing that, I was writing the book, you know, I came outta the, I came outta canon, probably like you did, right? I wrote the book, I did a TEDx, you know, I did all these speaking gigs, right? And I’m like, and I felt super confident. Meanwhile, I had no freaking clue what I was doing as an entrepreneur. And so I, you know, joined a bunch of masterminds including a brand builders group. Mm-Hmm. , which we both have in common. And as you know, the good news is that there are so many gurus and playbooks and things out there to teach you.

And so what happened to me was I was sitting in Nashville at a two day event and sort of handed this 82 page PowerPoint and you know, here’s how you do it. Here’s how you build your speaking career. I think it was right. And I was like, every play, it was gorgeous, it was comprehensive and I totally should have been thrilled, but I was actually paralyzed, right? So I’m over here talking like, you know, do everything. And now I’m trying to learn the rules and I’m sitting there, and of course, first I spun, right? Oh, Erin, you’re so, you like, you sprinted so much in your first career, you’ve run outta steam. Like you no longer have the energy to do big like, you know Mm-Hmm. all the things,

CS:
All the negative talk.

EH:
All the negative talk. And then I just paused and I said, what, what if you 50% rule it? And what that meant to me was what if you give yourself permission to only take about half, take the half that you know doesn’t feel authentic to you, that feels icky, maybe stale, boring, or just you don’t wanna do it. It’s throw it out, right? Mm-Hmm. throw it out. But leave room to curate your own 50%. Really look at what is the intent of this? What could you do that’s unique and different? I love this. Mm-Hmm. . And so in, in a way to answer your question, and then I’ll kind of finish the story. I mean, it is sort of like this authenticity hack that I had to learn. And, and, and you think of course like, oh, that was so helpful. I all of a sudden got motivated, I got excited, I got fueled up, right.

And I was gonna create things that would be different out in the market and not look like every speaker author Exactly. But then of course, you know, I then I did Amy Porterfield’s course and I got tripped up for a month and then I finally was like, you, like 50 rule, right? And, sort of had this epiphany. And, and so I went through my own sort of like using this as my own authenticity sort of wake up call and thing. And then it felt like every time I would talk to somebody, it would be a client or just a friend, and they would be stuck on something. I would be like, well, why don’t you 50% rule it and it would just come out, right? Like, I just wouldn’t even think about it. And they would be like, what is that right? like, oh, I think I pointed I would, right?

I would tell them. And they were like, oh my gosh. And then I started seeing, like, I go to team meetings and people are like, that’s 50% rule it. Like I just started to see it more and more. And then, um, what’s so cool and why I wrote a book and there’s 280 pages and not, you know, a meme I threw out on social media is then I just started to see it everywhere. So I was at Hamilton a couple years ago, a little late to the game, but like, you know, with a smile on my face and I was like, oh my gosh, Lin Manuel Miranda, 50% ruled Broadway, right? He took half, half normal, half, half new, and he smashed ’em together. I saw it with weird Ali Kovic, who is a horrible singer and a superstar, right? He 50% ruled music and it made him just, you know, skyrocket.

I saw Savannah Bananas and when they finally decided to 50% rule baseball and call it banana ball, get outta their regular league, like holy explosion. And so what got so, so exciting, I was like, oh my God, is I gotta write a book? Is that it wasn’t just, it’s not just an authenticity hack to get over your poop, you know, if you will. But it’s also this formula that helps you kind of go from underdog to unmatched because you, you one, you’re fueled and there’s data and research behind that, but also people, it creates something new and fresh so people pay attention. Yeah. Um, it does better out in the market. And so yeah, it’s sort of a journey of like, okay, here are all the sort of things to start to be more authentic. But if you also really want a shortcut, but you also want something that could skyrocket your, your business, your products, your, you know, sort of your brand, yes. That rule can do it.

CS:
Well, and it’s interesting ’cause I, it’s like you start to compete in a league of your own, right? The difference is that what do you compare Hamilton to when it first came out? If you go back to that moment in time, like no few people are like, I don’t know what to do with this. I mean, it is a musical, but it was hard to even explain. And I think that might be the litmus test is like if you, if you use the 50% rule to create innovation, which is what I’m hearing the link and whether that’s in a company creating a product. I worked at Proctor and Gamble during the time that Swiffer entered the market. Like it didn’t, there wasn’t a thing, right? Febreze wasn’t a thing. And uh, Mr. Clean Magic Eraser like wasn’t a thing, right? There were that you had to figure out how to create a category that people didn’t even know what to do with it because it didn’t, there was nothing to, you know, you’re trying, it’s half a mop and half a broom and half a, I don’t know, like, you know, people couldn’t even describe.

So that might be interesting, like, um, diagnostic is, if you find that something is kind of hard to explain, it might have been 50% ruled to be created. Yeah. So fascinating.

EH:
Yeah. Like the, one of the cool stories about Hamilton is that that was not the first time that Lin Manuel Miranda put on hip hop. Right, right, right, right. In the heights. Yes. But that’s why there’s so many layers to this rule that I talk about in the book. One of the layers is, you know, and its juxtapositions create Joyful Jolts. And so his, in like with, with In The Heights, it was a modern day Latina, you know, family Mm-Hmm. You sort of would expect that music, hip hop potentially, it’s not a usual Broadway. You would sort of expect those two. But when he juxtaposed and he smashed together old white dudes that wrote with other uh huh

With, you know, black and brown actors that sang hip hop, that collision was really, you know, I think that and just, you know, and just the

CS:
Brilliant Yeah. Excellence. Yes.

EH:
I mean there’s some excellence there of course too.

CS:
I think just a little, just just a little with Lin-Manuel. Right. Little talent. And it does, it can feel, we talk about business for a second, I think it can feel scary as like a business owner, in my case, a marketer in my P&G career or some of our listeners who work in corporations to really be breaking away from comparison because you’re losing the tethered point of like, how do I help people understand what this is? And, you know, creating a category or becoming like an n of one can feel nerve wracking. Yeah. So how do you encourage people to really find the courage to do that? And then also to define what success looks like, because it may be different than whatever models we’re kind of the inspiration.

EH:
That’s such a great question. I mean, I think first of all, that’s the exciting thing that’s the cool thing about the 50% rule. It sort of takes you half outta your comfort zone, half not Mm-Hmm. . So I write about in the book, like at first you’re, you know, you, there’s just such a binary, like you do, you boo and then, you know, the ridiculous metaphor, I was like, and then you’re like, you know what, I’m gonna wear my underwear on the outside of my pants. Like, no. And me, and then you’re like, oh, this is a little awkward. Right? And then the opposite is, you know, oh, I’m gonna just wear normal underwear underneath my pants. And the 50% rule says like, no, like part of what is important is hold on to half, hold on to half. Like, and maybe it’s, you know, LED lit underwear underneath your pants. Like it’s

CS:
You with these examples talk about it’s

EH:
It is super ludicrous. It’s super ludicrous. Some of my stories make sense. Unexpected.

CS:
Unexpected.

EH:
Some are a little bit wacky, but, but there is some beauty, you know, in sort of being weird, Al was like, yeah, I’m a pop singer, I’m a singer. I sing songs you’ve heard of. I just sing them with different lyrics. Lyrics and funny. Right. Same with Hamilton, even though it was like, you still knew it was a Broadway play. Right. So there was, it sort of has this safety, if you will.

CS:
Yeah.

EH:
And then I think, what was the second question about how do you explain it or

CS:
Yeah, I was just, I was thinking about how do you make it safe for people? Like how do you compete truly when you’re in a category of one, when it can feel like you’re not tethered to anything? How do you even give people way to explain

I think they don’t have to.

EH:
I think that’s really hard actually. And I think the tethering is the other 50%. Mm-Hmm. if that’s what you see, to be honest. So, and, and I use it, uh, I mean I use it as a mental thing. Like, you, you experienced this, right? Like, we are so supportive of all our peers, but then, you know, then you’ll see some posts on like Instagram or LinkedIn, you’re like, oh God, they’re freaking crushing it and this, you know, thing and I’m not, and I always go back and I’m like, oh, wait a minute. That’s not, I I, that’s not the same path I’m taking. That’s right. Right. And so I always have this mindset. So when I say competing in a league of your own and sort of in the subtitles and stuff, I am, I really mean like not, maybe not a one, but you are very confident that it’s your own path and you’ve, you’ve curated to get there. And it just to get into a mindset that says comparisons are just not possible. They’re not relevant. It’s, I, because I’m doing half the path differently, it is just literally not rational to compare me to something else that is half in a different box.

CS:
Yeah. And I think in a way it can create a really significant competitive advantage. Again, if we’re using, we’re kind of blending the two use cases, right? It could be individuals who are going to 50% rule it and it’s like a personal thing. And then we also could look at it through the lens of a product, a company, an organization. So I think certainly everyone should be an individual and I think we could agree like, yes, we wanna be ourselves, but it gets particularly tricky in the context of business where you are trying to kind of carve out a competitive slice. So I, I think it’s, I’m admirable that this idea crosses both. That’s rare, right? Often it’s like it applies to a person or it applies to, applies to an organization. But this really does apply to both because I see so much, there are so many legs to this idea around innovation in organizations who are trying to consistently innovate. And again, large, I grew up in one of those companies, right? My early career was in a company that really is predicated upon consistent innovation. So, um, that’s like deep in my deal.

EH:
No, you’re spot on. I mean, the book is literally organized 50% rule your professional development, 50% rule your leadership. ’cause we also have to remember when we’re giving advice to be like, that’s right. And even today, like, Hey guys, you’re listening. Only take half of what I have to say. 50% rule it, right? Mm-hmm 50% your business innovation and 50% your personal life. And then what I found after writing it and sort of telling a bazillion stories and there’s over 60 some quotes, I also realized, oh, and there are six core principles that transcend all of them. The juxta spells jigsaw, but there are the juxtapositions, like I talked about. And then there are five other principles. So yeah, I mean it’s, it’s not something where I wake up every day and I’m like, I’m gonna apply. It’s, it’s literally, and by the way, you know this, there is no such thing as a company. Like there really is, there’s a bunch of people, right?

CS:
Two people or like, oh,

EH:
It helps companies. Well what are companies? Well there they’re just a bunch of people. Yes,

CS:
Yes. But, and, and the important point, because those leaders in the organizations as well as every member of them are really creating a culture, right? Collectively, like their behavior shapes the culture. And so if you can influence the collective behavior to say like, Hey, we embrace this. We don’t follow rules off a cliff, we’re, we’re really gonna take, if we 50% rule as a corporate culture, then we’re nurturing each other to kind of keep finding that next edge. Yep. And I think that could be a powerful transformation. It’s making me think a little bit about kids and teenagers in particular. You and I were talking about both being mothers of teens when we were getting this episode started. And I think this is particularly hard for them. I think it’s difficult as a teen to acknowledge your own even willingness to stand out, right? Like, I always love how Brene Brown said Be brave, kind and awkward. And it’s like, for me, emphasis on the awkward, like it’s so hard to em embrace that part and yet it leads directly to this work. So any, any thoughts for parents of teens?

EH:
Yeah. I mean, well so a couple of thoughts on that. I mean, one, I mean my parent, let me just say my parents are both teachers, but I’m gonna, PPO I mean is no individual person’s fault, but I think the education system conditions us, whether it’s when we’re in it or quite frankly for years, maybe a lifetime after that. There is, the answer is, see the rubric is this, yes. You know how to write, uh, you know, my daughter’s in a million essays, how to write a proper essay. It starts with an introduction and then the transit, right? And so I think sometimes we mean, I don’t wanna get into a philosophical, but I, you know, I think there’s social pressures, but I think also school sort of damages and says there is, there’s a rubric for, for success. And then we get into the corporate world and nobody says, ah, throw that all out.

EH:
Actually we just want results. And you can come up with a playbook to get there and you know, nobody sits you down and says, you know, take half of what’s, you know, been done before and maybe innovate the other half. Yes. So I, you know, I think it’s hard for any human to go from being conditioned that you have to be right. I mean, thinking of corporate America, even back to just core authenticity. Why are people inauthentic? ’cause they’re trying to get the test right? They don’t know that that’s what they’re doing, but they’re like, that test is, I went to, I saw this other executive and here’s how they did the meeting. Yeah. And I, the, if I get it right, I will save my job or I’m more likely to get promoted or not get kicked. Well

CS:
We get rewarded for that. I mean, I think, you know, sometimes I call my audience grown up good girls because it’s like you, like everybody always giggles when we say it too. Yeah. But it’s like you really got rewarded for following the rules. Right? And, and that’s how we earn like all of our shiny gold stars growing up. And so you, you’re really advocating, like you gotta break some of them too. And that’s, I think, this inflection point where you’re moving to the next level. And maybe the earlier we move that inflection point, the better your point about schools. But it is like we are breaking a pattern of behavior where following a path or a pattern or a rubric matters. And now it’s like breaking it is actually where you get all the best results. So it’s, it’s a, it’s an,

EH:
And I’m calling and I’m calling it a rule, which is irony, but maybe it’s

CS:
A new, you rewrote a rule, it’s

EH:
Easier to adopt it when you’re like, oh, I know what a rule is. I like rules. Right. Can be a new one.

CS:
Well I, as I said at the beginning, you are a delight. And so I would love for people to be able to find their way to your work. Where is the best place for me to point them?

EH:
Yeah, I would say, you know, one to interact with LinkedIn. I’m a, I’m a LinkedIn geek, so, all right Erin, if you can spell my name,

CS:
I will, I’ll put it in the show notes

EH:
Only Erin Hatzikostas in the world or at least on the internet. Um, and then you can check out B just the letter B authentic inc.com. And that has lots of freebies, uh, it has the books, it has lots of information so you can head there as well. And then once you’re done binging this podcast, I have a, I do have a podcast called because Work doesn’t Have to Suck. And so I know you’re a podcast listener so you could always head over there as well.

CS:
Fantastic. And that, can they get to that from your website as well? Yeah, the podcast. Okay, great. So we’ll link the website and the LinkedIn profile so people can find you. And thank you so much for being generous with your time today. It was great to share your ideas with this audience.

EH:
My pleasure.

CS:
Well that was fun. I hope you had as much fun learning from Erin as I had talking to her. I really do think I’m gonna be thinking about the 50% rule for a good long while, as well as her human principles, like the framework that she shared with us. I know that as we were going through that framework, um, I was jotting down the specifics. So I’m just gonna recap for you here ’cause you’re probably going, what were humans again? It was humility, the unexpected modeling, adapting, narrating and spark. That’s what humans stood for. And you will find that inside of her work. So we are linked up to Erin’s online presence in the show notes so that you can easily navigate your way to be in touch with her if you choose to do that. And if you are new to the Brilliant Balance Show and just found your way here because of Erin’s work, I’m so glad to have you. Thank you for taking the time to listen to this episode and I hope you’ll come back for a future one or take a look through our archives. There are obviously more than 360 episodes at this point that you can go take a look back at. And I will be back with another one for you next week. Till then, let’s be brilliant.